Condoleezza Rice's testimony

[ribbon]

Did anyone else watch her testimony to the special commission on television?

I was very disappointed because it seemed more like a political debate than a testimony to get information about terrorism. She was very defensive. The questions were accusitory. What got me the most was the clapping to certain questions and answers :reallymad.
I'm not going to get into my thoughts about Condi and the Bush administration. Anyone who's read my posts in current events already knows :sarcasm. I was very disappointed in the process.

[mytots]

blah. i was just furious that they interrupted Starting Over for all that monotoned stuff. I don't bother tuning in to debates and such. They are going to do whatever they wanna whether i watch it or not, whether i like it or not..

[kers]

i watched all morning--riveting. mytots, i know sometimes politics just seems distant and overwhelming, but it doesn't have to be! (i may be biased as i grew up in DC and really get attched to federal news issues....!)

the thing that angered me is that no one (except for clarke) seems willing to just lay it all out and admit that mistakes were made and that those mistakes *might* have made the terrorist attacks less devastating. for example, rice admitted there was a memo that indicated potential hijackings, but she said there was nothing to be done about it. i think had all americans been made aware of that, security might have been tighter--and we certainly would have reacted to the first plane crash very differently. people might not have stayed in the towers thinking it was an accident, etc. etc.

i'm not trying to start a fight, i'm just so frustrated with feeling like the government doesn't do everything it's obligated to and doesn't admit its weaknesses and failures. (and i'm equal-opportunity on this! i have lots of problems with the clinton administration too!)

anyway. seeing her testimony just made me think about all we lost that day, and it had been awhile since i had.

[ribbon]

:hugon mytots :hugoff I was mad SO wasn't on too :muhaha . Why can't they put that stuff on the cable news channels for those who want to view it.

:hugon kers :hugoff I totally agree with you.
the thing that angered me is that no one (except for clarke) seems willing to just lay it all out and admit that mistakes were made and that those mistakes *might* have made the terrorist attacks less devastating.

I would have so much respect for those who said that (even if I didn't agree with their political views :winky). The current administration seems to be trying to look strong by all this denial and pussyfooting around, when I think that makes them look weaker. It would be strong to say, we fucked up and he's how we're looking to prevent that.

[Pretender]

I certainly watched it too. God, that lady was patient! :surprise I don't think I could have handled all that interrogation!

[Old Geezer]

Hey Kers-
I agree - they should just come out and tell us what's going on! Why is it people think that trying to cover up mistakes with lies will make anything better? Most of the time you just get caught in the "tangled web". If they would just say "hey it was a mistake" and learn from it most Americans would have more respect for politicians. At least I would.
The other side of the coin though is that we don't want politicians doing the wrong things and then just blowing it off as a mistake. This could lead to "it was a mistake" becoming an excuse to do whatever they wanted and that would be no good. I guess it is all perspective. It would be nice to have an honest politician for a change and then we would not have to worry about secrets so much!

Geezer

[Vicks]

Personally I am not for the government wasting all this money on investigations after investigations. It is a ton of money.

As far as her apperence. As someone who is not for the Bush administration quite the oposite I felt she did a pretty damm good job. Noone can say she isn't intelligent, and isn't well spoken. She held her ground. Which I think was a very impressive thing.

Her apperence, is basically a performance. Does anyone realize that when she was interviewed behind closed doors only half of the members on the panel showed up, but when it was on T.V. they all made sure to be there front and center.

So I give her a "job well done" I do'nt necessarily agree with what she said, but she did a good job.

Vicks

[ribbon]

Interesting, because I thought she sounded quite defensive, which I suppose isn't unusual considering the tone was adversarial. It would have been hard not to be defensive under those circumstances. Many of her responses seemed more like she was giving campagin speeches for Bush, rather than trying to give the commission information about what was known before sept eleventh :septll .
I give her a C and the televised part of the hearings a D because of the obvious particism, clapping and laughter that made them seem less serious and important than they really are.

Personally, I don't see how anyone could have imagined that bin laden and crew would fly airplanes into the twin towers and that the towers would topple. I'll bet if they polled one thousand people the majority (if not all) would not have thought that possible, not in the :usa. I wouldn't blame Bush or his administration for underestimating what could happen. Everyone was shocked. I didn't hear anyone saying, "I knew something like that was going to happen." People walked around in a daze, awed that this could happen here. Perhaps it was arrogance or naivete or both.
If only Bush and his posse would just be honest and then we can move on and forward.

[BOO_POOKIE]

While I didn’t see the briefings with Rice, I have been following the issue in the news. My “big picture” thought about the whole thing is that it seems like a waste of time (and money, as someone already pointed out).

I mean, we all know that hindsight is twenty/twenty, right?

And even if something in a document seems glaringly obvious to us in our post nine-eleven world, who’s to say how it appeared to Bush& Company when they saw it prior to the attacks? Not to mention that it was no doubt one of MANY, MANY things on their agenda on the day(s) that it came across their desks….

Just my two cents…
--Boo

[shortstop]

I watched the second half of the testimony and was glad that I didn't waste my time and get up early for the first half. (west coast :fishy) I had suspicions that it was going to be a bunch of b.s. The Bush admin took long enough to say it was okay for her to testify which makes me think that they were just trying to get all of their stories straight. Yeah, I know that they didn't want to set a precident for the future and that the security of the office has to be kept...but come on...they knew that the inquiry was coming. I was appalled at the clapping...the first time I heard it I thought that I had accidentally changed the channel! I don't think that the problem was preventing nine-eleven...that, in all reality, really wasn't preventable. I mean, really...who knew? No one. I think the problem was with how our improperly elected president reacted to the situation. He used it to get to Iraq. And now those troops are there and dying because of it. I think it's all a very sad situation which was made to look like a joke with the testimony.
Yeah...if you hadn't guessed, I'm a democratic liberal who doesn't like Bush or the war..:muhaha

[ribbon]

shortstop said: IYeah...if you hadn't guessed, I'm a democratic liberal who doesn't like Bush or the war..:muhaha

I knew there was a reason I liked you :winky. I agree with every word that you said.

[ESB]

I thought the portion of the ************ commision (I saw the portion with Dick Clarke, George Tenet, Samual Berget (?) and the poor guy who was instead of C.Rice) was extremely intriquing. I found the participants passionate and honest; sincerely more honest and passionate than any politician I am knowledgable about). In all honesty, how does one or a government prevent an occurrance like the ************ from taking place? Does anyone honestly believe the government would allow four planes to be hijacked, and three flown into buildings with thousands or hundreds of people working? Do any of us recall any tidbits heard on the news (US or elsewise) regarding other potential terrorist incidents? I do. Sure you can say, "Those are bullshit stories." Any more bullshit than allowing WTC to knocked down after ~ thirty years? Any more bullshit than the governement allowing expirements on US citizens with various drugs and chemical weapons? Any more bullshit than the Manhatten Project?

It makes me angry that the FBI and the CIA did not communicate in any way shape or form- that in itself deserves an investigation. But not an investigation determining blame for historically the communication was not encouraged; blame does not solve anything, we all understand that concept, rooting out the underlying flaws, miscommunication, missing links, even the emotional aspects hinged upon power struggles.... Contrary to my previous dissertation, what use is a National Security Advisor who does not communicate to the president because she/he did not know the information available to the various organziations within the government set up for those very purposes? I do not believe this is just a figure head department. I believe the suggestions call for an admitance in faulty, and perhaps categorical dismissal of facts not understood due to poor communication. But think of it this way.... as individuals, within companies, and essentially within, even MDC's, countries there is a learning process. **************** dead in any context is horrible and incomprehensible, even after the event; it was the impetus for the ************ commision, Homeland Security, the war in Afghanastan and the war in Irag. Many actions could have been taken- obvious to recognize in hind-sight, and the ************ commision was designed to understand the underlying problems and propose and implement solutions within the government. One of the solutions being to promote better communication between the national and international agencies.

I am angry that the ******** bombing of the WTC, the **************** Cole Bombing, the **************** bombings of the Beirut Marine Barracks, the Embassy bombings in Africa and a few others did not tought the national interest enough to encourage such a commision as the ************ commision. However, I am grateful, albeit wish it could have arisen out something less drastic, that something has finally caught the attention of the nation as a whole. I am also hoping the ************ commision public hearings, along with the ensuing publicity will remind the US public of the devestation and the civil rights violations (due to government policy enacted as a direct reaction to ************. I am not against profiling for terrorists. I am against prohibiting a member of the military from carrying his medal on a plane because it set off the medal detector. Or not allowing someone with a wired jaw to bring a metal implement on a plane incase of accidental choking. I apologize, but I cannot recall the exact details of these two stories.) which occurred on and after ************. The nation needs to come together and stand as one.

I do not agree with all of the government actions, however I cannot blame one for the actions of another. I do not believe the terrorist were born out of a religion of peace; I do not believe the US as a nation could have prevented this event from occurring because the terrorist hate and dispise this nation and its people for who we are as a whole from a historical and current perspective. I do believe the terrorist were born out of years of civil unrest in an area of the world with a culture very different from that of the US (in specific). I also beleive the leaders are attempting to prove their superiority by attacking other countries and cultures which are leading the world in economy, freedom and a threat to their ideology which spews civil rights violations as a way of life and salvation.

Any ways, I just vented- again- to an audience who may or may agree. I do not care. The last thing we need is a population which does not support the governement while doing nothing to change policy either through lack of voting, not writing letters to people in government, not supporting the troops, and not fighting for democracy, freedom of speech, liberty for all ( since the civil rights movement) and happiness. We do need to sacrifice and we do need to voice our opinions and we do need to communicate.

[Shauna]

ribbon said: Personally, I don't see how anyone could have imagined that bin laden and crew would fly airplanes into the twin towers and that the towers would topple. I'll bet if they polled one thousand people the majority (if not all) would not have thought that possible, not in the . I wouldn't blame Bush or his administration for underestimating what could happen. Everyone was shocked. I didn't hear anyone saying, "I knew something like that was going to happen." People walked around in a daze, awed that this could happen here. Perhaps it was arrogance or naivete or both.
If only Bush and his posse would just be honest and then we can move on and forward

My feelings exactly. I recall watching a news station recap how the bombers executed the plan that day. It was absolutely unreal. There is no way it could have been prevented.

One thing that bugs me is the terror alert. Seems to me that by publicizing heightened security no one would want to bomb when it's high anyway. What about just the normal days? There was nothing special about the date of September eleventh (meaning it's not a holiday or anything.) Seems to be there are better ways to spend taxpayers dollars. I mean, really, bombers aren't really going to let their plans known. Perhaps SOMETHING would be leaked...but there's no way to know when, when, or even if something like September eleventh would happen in the States again.

[kers]

Personally, I don't see how anyone could have imagined that bin laden and crew would fly airplanes into the twin towers and that the towers would topple. I'll bet if they polled one thousand people the majority (if not all) would not have thought that possible

I agree, to a certain extent--right after that day, I know I thought, "There's NO WAY we could have ever known this was going to happen. It was entirely not preventable."

But now I wonder. There have been security briefings released that show that the FAA was notified that hijackings were suspected of being executed. Terrorism experts recognized that one of many techniques al qaeda seemed to be interested in was using planes against buildings. the problem seems to be that there was so much data and so mny possibilities that these slipped throught the cracks.

but what makes me mad and sad is to think, what if on that morning everyone in america had known that there was an increased risk of hijackings? people might not have stayed in the towers thinking it was an accident. the military jets might have been scrambled immediately and all flights could have been grounded.

i thought it was unfathomable that it could happen, and what's frustrating is finding out that it wasn't.

either way, one thing that has come out of that day, good or bad, is that i think we can believe anything can happen. it's changed the way we deal with situations.

[kapoker]

:hugon ribbon :hugoff

Do you watch "The Daily Show" at all? I absolutely loved his coverage of the ****/******** testimony. I think you might really enjoy that show :muhaha

take care,
Rachel :peep

[ribbon]

kers said: I agree, to a certain extent--right after that day, I know I thought, "There's NO WAY we could have ever known this was going to happen. It was entirely not preventable."

But now I wonder.

I agree with you in theory. I am putting myself in the shoes of those who could have done something (and that is sooo hard for me because I don't like the president and use any excuse to criticize him :muhaha). I think that there was a LOT of denial going on and the belief this can't happen here.

One of my friends used to do security at Heathrow over ten years ago. She said that it was commonly known that the :usa were very loose with security on airplanes, particularly in contrast to israel, who were the most prepared. The baggage handlers would often make comments about the how easy it would be to do something on an american plane.

She was absolutely shocked about :septll . She lives in europe and said that no one could believe something like that could have happened in the :usa and that such large buildings could fall.

Hindsight is twenty-twenty and I wil for this one case :winky not blame the administration :muhaha.

Rachel I don't watch it, but I think i should start. Is it on comedy central?

[kapoker]

ribbon, it's on Comedy Central at eleven pm ET...definitely worth watching! And the more you watch the real news, the funnier it is. Let me know if you like it!

take care,
Rachel :peep

[ribbon]

I caught part of the daily show last night before I fell asleep :muhaha. I love Jon Steward's sense of humor. I wish it wasn't on at the same time as the news, because I hate to miss that. If I can manage to stay awake I'm going to start to watch it regularly. Thanks for telling me about it.

[kapoker]

ribbon,
I'm glad you caught some of the Daily Show! My housemate and I think that Jon Stewart should run for President...I think the world would be much better off!

Did you catch the bit about who will be gaining sovereignty of Iraq on June thirtieth? I bet people all over will be creeping downstairs in their footy pajamas to find out :muhaha :muhaha

take care,
Rachel :peep

[ribbon]

kapoker said:
Did you catch the bit about who will be gaining sovereignty of Iraq on June thirtieth? I bet people all over will be creeping downstairs in their footy pajamas to find out :muhaha :muhaha


Yes :muhaha and I loved the part in the beginning where he was talking about Israel and Palestine. I have a very similar style of humor, emphasizing the obvious with voice tone and facial expressions.

I hope I can stay awake for the whole thing tonight.